for those fortunate enough to help the person who has always been their hero. Find the care guides you need to help at AARP dot org's slash Caregiving Brought to you by AARP and the ad Council from The Wall Street Journal This is instant message. I'm David Pierce. This is a show about technology, how it's changing, what's going on and what all of it actually means for your life.

Since this

is our very first episode, let me explain how the show's gonna work. First, I'm gonna bring in my colleagues, Joanna Stern and Christopher Mims, who are actually listen to me right now, and we're gonna talk about the biggest things on our minds this week. Well, it's phone season, and we're gonna talk about which of the new devices from Apple, Google, Samsung and everybody else are actually worth your money. And we're going to see if there's any truth to the idea that in a few years your pizza and packages might be delivered by drones. Guess what? There's actually some truth to the idea. After that. Joanna has the first of our weekly upgrades,

something quick and easy you can do to make your Tech life better. Turns out she has weirdly strong feelings about iPhone charging. Lastly, we'll spend a few minutes digging a little deeper into a particular topic or person that matters right now in the tech world. This week I talked to James Dyson. He's been making vacuums for decades, but now his company develops everything from hair dryers to electric cars. We talked about smart homes. What happens when every object you own is connected to the Internet and lots more So stay tuned for that. Every week is gonna be a little different on the show, but they're all gonna be fun. I promise. Okay, Ready? Let's get started. Joining me now. Joanna Stern in our New York studio and Christopher Mims over Skype from Baltimore.

Guys. Hello, Christopher.

Uh, hello. Hello?

Are we podcasting

coming through? We're doing

it. Oh, guest in. That's the song way. Podcast.

You been working on this for months

now? It's very I mean, every time we've done the pilot of the show, I sing that song and I've perfected it.

Okay, so the first thing we need to talk about is that over the last what? Six weeks? It has just been a crazy onslaught of new phones. There's three new iPhones. There's two new Google pixels. Samsung did some stuff, something about foldable phones coming later this year. But it feels like now is the moment. Every year when we get to say, actually, there is some answer to If you want a new phone, we know the answer, and Joe and I want to start with you because you've spent all of this time using the iPhone and then trying to switch away from the iPhone and then using another new iPhone. And I feel like you have more clarity on this than anybody. So, first of all, if people want to buy new iPhones this year and lots of people always d'oh ah, what's what iPhone Should they buy? Is there a clear right answer?

At this point, it's been so tiring. David. It's been so many phones. I sleep with the iPhone. 10 are now as my pillow, but for many weeks I was using the 10 s. It's been tough times, but I think my my answer. I never say this as as firmly as I mean every year I have to answer this question, but this year. I have a very firm answer, and it is to buy the iPhone X are some people call it The 10 are, But I call it the ex are

so you can just agree that no matter what Apple calls it, your correct name is the X R. Yeah. I

don't care what anybody else actually. Fun, fun Fact. When I was tracking doing the voiceover for my video, I had to write out the word 10 because every time I did the track, I kept saying, X r so 10 R x r is really ex ours, right? Correct. So, yeah, this is what I've said. This is the bright phone for everybody. Unless there's a couple of small little things that make the 10 s or the X s excessive, as we're now calling it, there are a couple of reasons to go up, but I really don't think most people should,

You know, there's. Then there's the lower and models that are still available. The old phones, the seven and eight, which are good choices. But the 7 50 10 are is just that apple sweet spot. So

my thing with that has always been that my phone logic for years has been basically that you should upgrade only when you need to. And when you need to, you should buy the absolute best, most impressive, probably most expensive phone you can afford. The device you use the most often it's the most important one. You're not gonna upgrade all that often, so you might as well just spend as much money as you can and get. The best thing is that why is that not good advice anymore? Or

is that not good advice? Right. So what Apple did this year was they had the 10 s or the tennis Max that they sort of the upgrade from the 10 last year that everyone made a huge deal about, and Apple made a huge deal about and when we reviewed it, we're actually really impressed with it and had all these new features. But guess what? It was $1000 that sounds like crazy for people to buy a phone. And this year they introduced the 10 s, which kind of feels that bucket but then and starts at $1000. But now they have The 10 are, which starts at $750 pretty much has almost the exact same features as the $1000 phone. The places where they sacrifice or you make sacrifices in the screen doesn't have an old lead. Screening, has an LCD screen. It doesn't have two cameras on the back. It only has one single camera. And really,

that's the extent of the sacrifices. And so if you are obsessed with screens, if you're like complete screen snob and you're like Oh my God, that screen looks disgusting, which never ever happened because it's a really nice screen, then sure, you can get the tennis. But if you're just used to having a really nice iPhone screen and a really good iPhone camera, this this phone is the perfect phone for most people. I mean, honestly, everybody.

I love the screen thing because it's like Apple spent all these years saying we made a retina display. It's so good we couldn't possibly make it better. And even if we did, your eyes wouldn't notice the difference. And then they come in and they're like, Well, okay, we made it better again, and now I have to spend lots of money to get the best screen. It's like no use just said like five years ago, that this is the best screen that your eyes can understand. And I kind of believe that Then maybe we should

just stop there. Yeah, I'm like if you're looking at these phones side by side than sure, but nobody's doing that. So you will take this phone and you're like, This is a beautiful LCD screen. $750. That's the entry level, right? But you can go up and it's still it's still pretty much covers under $1000. And to me, like actually, what's happening is that Apple's marketing is sort of just working, in a sense, right? Like last year, they made us think,

Oh my God, we need to spend $1000 for the best phone ever And so people did that and we couldn't believe it, and we justified it because it's got all this great technology. You're gonna have it for 10 years now. They're like, actually, here's a great phone. It's $750 which is $100 more than our average. The the phone that they used to introduce the iPhone eight or iPhone seven All started $650 like now it's at $750. But it's not $1000. Isn't that amazing? And so the marketing is just working wonders and probably worked on me as well. So the

price thing is interesting to me and Christopher. I wonder what you make of this because you wrote a while ago about the idea that Apple's next phase is less about making all of its money from the iPhone and Maura about trying to get you to buy an iPhone so that you start to buy other things and be part of its service is and things like that. And Apple is not a company you normally associate with charging less money for things over time. In fact, it's usually the exact opposite apples, pretty much clearly, making its best phone $250 cheaper than last year. Is this a sign that they just want more people to buy it so that they'll also buy apple watches and airpods? Well, I mean, we'll see what people end up buying, right, because not everybody's gonna agree with us. Plenty of people they're gonna buy the access or the excess max. I mean, we don't know until we see their quarterly results whether the average selling of price of these phones could actually go up. That's true.

But even the existence of a phone that's good and this cheap seems unusual for Apple. That's true. I mean, they are, as ever, pushing toward service's revenue. And, you know, you do wonder at what point they're like, you know? Are we making

enough? I mean, what are

we gonna do this money really? Return it to shareholders. There must be some point at which they're like, OK, people have, you know, a certain tech budget and we expect them to spend it on phone and headphones and watch and a variety of health monitors and all these subscriptions we're gonna lock them into, you know, and we have great margins on all this. So

get on cases, iPhone cases. They're going to definitely spend it on that, but actually to crime story. And that's like what was really hard about this review? Is that it off like, Yes, they're great phones and actually want to write a separate peace. Being like this is just marketing like we are falling for so much marketing. It's like marketing. I mean, not 101 because it seems more advanced. But like like Christopher said, a lot of people won't listen to us, right? They'll go into the store and thereby the 10 s. Because guess what?

Products that cost more must be better. They must be. It's they must be $250 better than the 10 are right? And so Apple's kind of tricked us all. And that's why I like what I say in the review, is this. 10 art feels better than the $750. It's just a cz good in many for most people than as that $1000

phone. Yeah,

I mean, and it feels

like, in general were in this funny place where all phones really have reached a point where even if you notice the difference is side by side. If you just buy one, you're gonna like it. Like I reviewed the Google pixel, and it was a weird one to review because the Pixel three is an awesome phone with awesome camera that I think in most cases, is better than the iPhone or anything else. That's out there, but a There's all kinds of data now that says nobody switches. So if you're using Android, you're gonna keep using Android. And if you're using an iPhone, you're gonna keep using an iPhone. And even if you're using like a Samsung Android phone, you're probably going to stay there. So the idea that people are going to sort of jump around for the best new thing just doesn't seem to exist anymore. Running this place where it's like,

Okay, I bought $1000 phone two years ago, or in this case a year ago, it was great. Now I want a new one. My new phone probably cost $1000 it just like we're on rails with this stuff now, where it's everybody kind of already knows what phone they're going to get next, which is a very

strange phenomenon, right? And then you factor in, like, upgrade programs. I've heard from a lot of people who are in the apple upgrade programme, saying, Shall I get the 10 are shy, Get the tenants, and why would you get either of them if you have the 10 from last year? And so again the upgrade programs to become this really clever marketing scheme for people to always get the greatest in latest new phone by paying Apple a certain amount of money every month. And so, yeah, it goes back to that like you're not gonna switch. You're gonna keep upgrading within the same family of devices. What is really the benefit? Yeah, So do either

of you See, after this kind of new run of phones from Samsung and Google and Apple and everybody, Is there any is anything new here? Has anything changed or we just kind of everybody's doing. Used to say anything people were raving about, Yes, but just rolled out.

Christopher, can you tell us about what

it is because of the personal tech experts?

It's just like, well, just rolled out. We're sitting here podcasting. How would I know? It's

the super enhancement mode on low light pictures that makes them look like they were shot in normal late without adding a lot of green. And it is a very Google e thing because it is not simply a matter of enhancing the image in like a typical way. There's some software wizardry here, you know, Google is really good at doing those, like adobe photo shop type effects, where you know you can't. You try to remove an object from an image automatically, and then it guesses what would be behind there. So, you know, as others have said at this point, a lot of the innovation that is meaningful even on cameras on phones is is in software. Yeah, but that said, Are you gonna buy a pixel three?

He already has one. He just knows about this great new feature

that came out. Maybe he just I

I'm definitely not. And remember that pixel

is like, What is their market share? It's like 1% or less than 1%. I feel like pixel is like a lot of stuff that Microsoft does and what Google has done in, ah, like chrome os they make these flagship device is not so much because they plan on making money on them, but just to kind of whip everybody else into shape. It's a way of like wagging their finger at Samsung and being like, Hey, you better roll those android updates out faster because you've got some competition. They're just like shaming them into doing better It's like how when Microsoft came out with the surface tablet and it did so well and then eventually each being everybody else was like, Hey, we better do equally good Windows machines. I feel like that's what it's really about. Ultimately, I like it. One big piece of news this week was that Uber is looking to launch a giant fleet of delivery drones as soon as 2021 which sounds both far away and very soon all the same time.

We're gonna get into what all of that means with the help of our reporter who had this group, our own Greg Benzinger. He's sitting out in the newsroom right now, so I'm gonna go get him. I'll be right back.

What if he's not ready? But if he's eating lunch?

Yeah, knowing Greg, he's probably eating one training.

Yeah, he probably was delivered by a drunk, but you think drugs had had for lunch? That's what we should have. We should have a question that we ask our listeners right in and tell us what you think rug is having

for lunch. 3100% of his meals there were delivered on the Amazon Prime now anyway.

What kind of future can

you get on there? He's just constantly dog food ing as they say that Greg is coming.

I knew he wasn't ready.

This is my editing is

a useful thing. No, we're not gonna edit. We get a whole bit. I'm like Greg is eating for lunch that

needs to be edited. I can't wait to listen to it in the podcast. Greg Benzinger, Thank you for coming on the podcast beer. We need, as always, to understand what in the world uber is doing because it's never, ever, ever clear. So you wrote the story this week about uber and delivery drones. Can you explain what what they're working on and what the news was this week? Well, I came across this job posting. They're looking for some sort of executive to help them with drone delivery. Specifically food drones that will bring you presumably prepared meals in a drone to your home instead of the cars that do it today for a breeds. It set out this sort of ambitious timetable off getting multiple markets with food delivery drones by 2021 even operational food delivery drones next year. when asked over about it that quickly pulled a job posting down and said,

You know, uh, that wasn't supposed to be there makes a reporter like me think it was supposed to be there, and I just stumbled upon it. It had been on there a couple of days, and it was clear that this was their ambition, and that's what I wanted to do. So I've never totally understood why uber eats was something that uber was all that interested in it. Like if if pizza joints say anything, it's that delivery is not a place to make a ton of money like Why is delivery drone something uber is after? Well, it turns out they're doing really well with new breeds growing really fast. This has turned out to be a big surprise for them. Uber has a sort of fleet of people already out with roads using their app and their customers driving for uber. And so it's not a big switch for them to just say, Well,

it's a slow period. Go, go, pick up some food. The big problem for uber and any other delivery company is, is the people over just hates humans I feel like humans are uber's problem. One of the interesting things that came out in this trial uber was sued by Google, and one of the interesting things that came out is 70 80% of the cost of any. Any ride is paid to the human. Whoever would like to get rid of that, so if they can do it, that's great. So, Christopher, I don't know what you think about this, too,

because you've you wrote recently about how robots in general are changing the whole sort of e commerce experience but talked a bunch about drones, too. And I feel like when I think about drones, all I think about is a the idea of a 1,000,000 tiny things flying in the air seems really unpleasant and be like Holy Lord, the noise. So, like, how is this actually going toe happen and work? Or is it just one of those things that, you know? Everybody says so they can raise more money in their I P. O. Well, it's it's definitely the 2nd 1 always, but it doesn't mean that it won't ever work. Greg,

are you sure that they were only talking about flying drones. By the way, A supposed to submarines or what? You're what other option are you referring to? Well, there's the, uh I'm sure you've seen the Ah, the self driving delivery. Ah, robots from Starship Enterprise is I'm sure you've probably tripped over one of those in San Francisco and then the ah, the larger, slightly larger ones. It's like one of them is the size of like a little schnauzer. And one is the size of like a German shepherd from neuro, the bigger ones that there's still something those there's there's like a human walking behind it. With Joyce,

it's like it's like a rolling suitcase deejay.

I thinks that drone delivery is bullsh. So I and so did, by the way, does Ocado and they have the most sophisticated ah, grocery delivery operation in the world? As far as I can tell, I think this is about as likely as Uber's flying car effort, although they talk against the extra about how they're gonna change regulations to make,

I mean, what are

the odds that they're gonna open up the airspace anytime soon? To even do this is one big problem

like this isn't This isn't like, Oh, we're gonna

put drivers on the road in cars that are indistinguishable from other cars so that we can invade cities before regulators can come after us like you can't just what are they going to do? Like gonna launch a fleet of unauthorized drones? You know, I just It's Zoe. I think they do what I think they do want to get it to a point where regulated, they're gonna find places where it is allowed somewhere in Southeast Asia. It's not clear yet where they might go, And I agree. There's a lot of concerns about these things flying over your head, people vandalizing them or shoot them out of the sky. Or wasn't it five years ago that Jeff Bezos said it was gonna be five years? It was It was almost to the day. The funny part is for me, like I like the idea personally. Like, I like the idea that I could be here on order something. In 20 minutes,

a drone flies through the window, but I don't want anybody else to be able to do it. I just I don't want millions of them in this guy. I just want one for me, which I feel like it's maybe not the best strategy. Joanna. What did you want to

say? I have a list of questions for Greg about his reporting that we don't necessarily have to use in the podcast. But I'm just wondering if he knows the answers to these is uber working on something so my food won't get cold. So, like, presumably, that the food is in the air, I don't know how long. How do we ensure that the food isn't

cold or or that it doesn't get warm and shield pasta salad, for example?

What about

it? It's a good question. I have. No, I don't know anything about what kind of storage box they might use. That's insulated. But in theory, it's much faster, right? So it it could actually drone delivery would help that problem, not hurt it. Theoretically, yeah, uh, dominoes and Pizza Hut have for the advanced space age technology to keep their your pizza warm. That's actually true. I love it. It is. You see Mylar blankets in there, and NASA came up with those.

Next question is, how will it confirm that I've picked up my food? Um like it just randomly drops the food on my front stoop. And then what?

You gotta ask the person who takes this job that you were pulled off and they have a big issue. Thanks for this one because I have pushed them on the same point. And their answer is simply that we're used to ups dropping things off on the front stoop because we don't know when UPS is gonna show up. If you know to the second when a drone is gonna be on your front stoop, you get it's the same. Thing is when you're uber arrives, you get a push alert on your phone, you walk outside, and presumably it's not like putting it in your hands. But you get it right. Then

then, last question is, how do we ensure the drones don't eat our

food? You have to program them not to be sentient. That's where the up to the

programmers. Okay, it's fine reporting.

Awesome. We got to move on. But, Greg, thank you for being here.

Should be on the podcast

every week. Agree they sold. So my interview with James Dyson is coming up. But before we get to that Joanna, I want you to tell everybody the tip you have for this week, which seems like the thing you liked the least

about the iPhone X are

10 are. And also the only thing you've talked to me about for like, two months now. So tell people how you feel about charging their iPhones.

How long do I have

for this segment? Seven and 1/2 hours. A

lot of time. Yes, that I'm going to start with. I want everyone to set the scene. Okay. You've just gotten this brand new iPhone. Maybe you spend $1000 on it, which is probably not the best idea. Maybe you've spent $750 on it. Your unboxing it. It smells beautiful. Actually, apple products don't smell amazing, but that's for another podcast. You're taking the plastic off the screen. You've got a new apple sticker which don't know what most people do with those. You're so excited about your new phone,

and then you see the sad charger that comes with it. It's a five watt charger. It's the this same charger we've been getting with iPhones since the original iPhone. It is the slowest charger in the history of the world, actually not sure about that fact checkers. Contract that. And so you plug in your iPhone to charge, and it takes forever. This is not a good use of our times. This is not a good use of our money. And so I suggest that everyone who's listening to this if you have an iPad, you use your iPad charger because your iPad charger is 12 watts. That's I can't do math. Seven watts more. My producer just told me seven wants more than what comes in the box, and it will charge twice as fast.

If you don't have an iPad charger, you should buy a cheaper charger online. I prefer I am a very big fan of anchor. They make great charging accessories. They do not pay me, but I do love their products. $15 for the power port to that has two USB to USB ports on it. Also, 24 watch charger will also charge twice as fast as the charger in the box. And so, yes, I know and an Apple claims that Apple says doesn't matter. People charge overnight, right? The battery last them through the whole day and then they charge with the five watt charger overnight. I don't think that's true.

I don't think most people get through the day with their their battery. Especially not on travel heavy days or days where you forgot to charge overnight or who knows, lots of lots of different people out there. Different scenarios. But when you charge, you want to get as much juice as fast and like that, I always Every time I give this tip, people ask, Well, that's not good for the health of the battery. That's also not true. Um, with new lithium ion batteries, you can't overcharge. You can't charge too fast. This is all built into the technology of the charger on the phone. All right. How many

hours do you need that wasn't that was it? That was the full six and 1/2. That was you did an amazing job on now is you conspiracy theory? Like, why do we think that they give awful chargers because they thought Thea, their wireless charger, would be out by now. Same thing is with head tones are like, Here's some cruddy wired headphones. Please

buy the airpods. Possibly. I mean, I think possibly two. They just haven't thought about in there. Like if people want to charge faster, they'll buy the more expensive fast charger that we sell for 40 bucks. Me. Apple makes a lot of money on accessories.

They Selves ready for 40 bucks,

even Maur if you go with the U. S. B C charger. Plus, you have to buy the U. S. B c chord lightning cord. So yeah,

crazy. We can argue about this, uh, every week on this podcast for as long as we have it, I promise. But for now, thank you both for being here and coming up. Next is my interview with Dyson CEO and vacuum mogul James Dyson about the connected future of pretty much everything.

What lies ahead for our planet? Join The Wall Street Journal and National Geographic Expeditions on an extraordinary journey. Explore either Israel and the West Bank, Colombia, China or South Africa and discover a more sustainable future book. Now, before these trips, sellout at nah. Geo expeditions dot com slash W S J or call 88820556 to 1. You

probably know Dyson, which has been making these super fancies super high tech vacuum cleaners for decades. But more recently, the company's branched out into things like hair dryers and fans and is now devoting a huge amount of resources to electric cars. Meanwhile, its most recent product, the air rap, is billed as a safer and better way to style your hair for $500. I'm pretty sure Joanna has one and likes it a lot, anyway. It's this weird large mix of things. So I wanted to know what makes James Dyson, the founder and inventor at the top of the company tick. He's worth billions of dollars. He has a sir in front of his name, and he could do anything he wants. So why vacuums in cars and not augmented reality or biotech or Cryptocurrency?

Actually, when we start developing technology, we always have at least one use for it. So at the moment, with our battery vacuum cleaners, you know we make 20 minute devising. Yeah, we consume about 18 120,000,006. 50 battery cells were huge. User of batteries have to factories permanently dedicated to it, so deciding to vote her a new battery for vacuum cleaners was enough. But then I've been having a battle with diesel on vehicle pollution for many years. During the nineties, we developed something to collect diesel exhaust pollution because it's very nasty particulars of knocks and socks. And it's not a good thing to breathe in bad for your lungs as well as your heart. On Gwen,

we approach the trucking industry with this invention in the nineties, they said, Oh, we don't want to take that because Abel A it's expensive and b we have toe have the problem of disposing of the black suit on carbonaceous cert in brackets is better for people to breathe it in to him to give us the problem. Having to displace Andi again. Vehicle manufacturer car manufacturers weren't interested either, so we had to drop that project. But I've had this sort of hate of vehicle pollution ever since for the last for the last 15 or 20 years. So when the when we started developing a battery on getting really quite close to having a a solid state solution, were also in electric motors. We do a lot of purifiers. We do heaters and coolers. S own electric car is batteries, electric motors, heating cooling, getting rid of pollution and a lot of effort.

Exactly a lot of air flows, so it just seemed right. Let's do a car, Isn't I'm not not a petrol head. It's just that we've got a little piece of technology of the part of a jigsaw of a new you know, the future of cars, my senses. There are fewer players working on reinventing hair styling products, but right now everyone is, and that's not to denigrate here, sign practice. But right now, sort of the big next thing is kind of what comes next. After the cars that we have now and there's self driving cars and there's electric cars and everything is about to be different and everyone is on it. And is this the wildest market you've thrown your hat into? Yeah,

yes, of course it is. It's caused a very big market, so there's room for quite a few players, but it hasn't have consolidated, so there aren't that many places. But I think a CZ electric car demands a very different chassis, a very different type of vehicle. So I think it's a it's a good time for for someone who hasn't got all the history on Dhe hasn't got huge factories producing internal combustion engines. It's a good time for a new player to jump in. You know it, really it It has to be the future. We have to do a better battery because the moment you have to put in eight or 10,000 sells for one car of something that is highly flammable. You know, one that was crashed in Switzerland for the television, the Top Gear television program is still burning.

Four months later, a new cell catches alike. So s O the lots of problems there, but we've got to solve. But I think there's a big prize there, and the prize is clean cities, healthier people and the on the Quanta quite alive in streets. And that does seem to be one of those things where it is obvious that that's where we end up. How we get there is slightly less clear. At least you know that's funny. That's funny, because that's where the invention can occur. And, you know, it's make quiet tires toe quite noisy. We must make quite a tires quite a road,

for that matter. But that's not gonna solve that. one. And the other part of that, I think, is, Ah, speaking of, you know, things that seem like obviously where we're going. But it's less clear how we're gonna get there. Um, I've read you talking about the smart home a little bit over the last couple of years, and I think the rest of the tech industry seems to be sort of slowly catching up to what you've been talking about for a long time. Which is that maybe we can apply technology to these things that are not necessarily considered, you know,

quote unquote gadgets and make them better. And we've arrived at this idea that, you know, everything is gonna be connected, and everything is gonna be smart. And yet it all seems like chaos that hasn't yet worked for riel people. They do. Do you have a smart home? No, no. I live in a very old hope because we're not really allowed to build new homes in England. And no, there's nothing smart about it, But I think I think the number you get these buzzwords and then people assume things. But I think what's sort of more interesting, I think things should be connected.

There's no doubt about that. And they are. I mean, we have reproduced lots of connective products. That's all great and very interesting. I'm perhaps rather wanting to get beyond that. I'm more interested in artificial intelligence on products, doing the right thing at the right time for you, as you are at the moment. So in other words, if you walk into a room, of course the lights will go on. But it'll sense your health. How hot you are with you're perspiring over the shivering and do all the right things for you. I already are purifiers. Sense the pollution in the room and switch on and deal with it and they can.

They'll tell you. It'll smartphone what they're doing and what the pollution, Woz and what level it waas. But also we actually display it on the product now because I've I got this theory that people don't necessarily want to go and jump into a capsule of time to see what's going on. Agree that I'm going if you like the stage beyond where you might glance at the product because to see if there's been any pollution. So it's important that our product knows it and deals with him. And you don't even need to know about it because our lives are gonna get so complicated. Products are going to get, be so capable and have so many features that we can't possibly control them, even if we do the extent of what they did. I'm not sure that people want a novel of dials. It's our job to put something a genuine piece of technology in front of people that obviously does the job properly so that they can understand what it is we're trying to say. So I'm I'm really rather more interested in things happening automatically and doing the right things automatically and turning your weather here well or unwell, whether about have a heart attack, all this kind of thing, I think.

And if products could do all that type of thing, then it's gonna make our lives much easier. Do you a sense of how possible that is. I mean, how could you take us to get there? Uh, it seems like such a lovely idea that's so far off from this happens because it is happening now. I mean, you know, we're part of the way and that way there now on dhe, cheap cameras and cheap sensing technologies. Sensing technology, I think, is one of the most interesting things of the future. Pretty crude at the moment, but interesting new senses that are very cheap coming up now.

I think we're nearly there. Well, thank you so much for being here. Really, It's a great pleasure, Thank you very much. And that's our show. Thanks to James Dyson, Greg Benzinger, Joanna Stern and Christopher Men's for being here. And thank you for listening. We're gonna be doing this weekly on Friday, So make sure you described in some message on Apple podcast Scougall, podcast Spotify or wherever you listen, send us back in ideas at personal tech ws j dot com We'll talk to you next week.