you know, I grew up drawing and I never stopped drawing. So it was always a creative kid and always tryingto, you know, draw something or figure something out to create something. And the advice I wish I got waas you're doing You're doing the right thing. You're doing exactly what you need to be doing at the time that you need to be doing it. And that comes into just base level perseverance. Just keep keep banging the drone, keep exploring, stay curious and and never stop.

You hear that? That's a Cynthy chill wavy version of our theme song, made especially for today's special guest, James White, a k a. Signal Boys. His neon used art is incredible. I don't think anyone does, uh, better than James White. And I was so thrilled to be able to talk to him today about his story and his art and what he's up to and what he digs. And I just learned a ton from James Super fun to talk to him. S o. I can't thank him enough for being on this'd is the simple bit show I'm your host. Stand cedar home. Very special, thanks to met a lab for sponsoring this episode.

I'll be talking a little bit more about mental lab later. Let's go back to the eighties with James White. Three ideal would be like I'm a puppet. It's a video podcast, and you're a puppet to

how do you know I actually didn't send you my head shot, So

U s a puppet would be actually amazing.

That seat. Now, Now, there's one thing I've got to get out of the way, though, Dan, I'm kind of disappointed here. Yeah, and I don't wanna I don't want a stereotype the puppet community or anything like that, but I was expecting a different voice, being that you're a puppet. Yeah. It was kind of expecting you and talk. You know, Kermit the frog is at six. I was expecting her. So,

you know, I'm kind of like, Oh, he just sounds like a guy. Eyes not

funny that, like most puppets, do have a very distinctive puppet voice.

Yeah, do it. Yeah, it's one of those things, like, you know, when somebody in the house is watching the Muppet Show or whatever. Because even though you don't, you don't see them, you know, like there's No way. That's a real person, right? That you're right. It's like, you know, without seeing them.

Yeah, it's the same with cartoons. Like when I was a kid, like I knew what my mom was in the laundry room, which is right next to where I was watching TV. I'd be thinking like Mom knows I'm watching a cartoon because it sounds like a cartoon. Even though they're just people talking, they sound

like cartoons. Yeah, there's just something they know what's funny, because there is, like one of my favorite Muppets were. No, we're talking about it. I'm thrilled, Um is Bobo the bear who's He's a Muppet is pretty obscure character. He has, like, bit parts in different movies, But there's like a full size bear, uh, but has a completely normal voice on. And I think that's what puts hilarious about it because he's he has, like,

a very business like voices often has like a suit on. He's like, Hello, Sir. That's why he's my favorite, I guess, because it's just a normal. He's a bit Everybody's a normal person.

That's fantastic. That must be the deal, correct. When Jim Henson was trying to come up with a voice like No, make him super normal. Yeah, exactly. That's what's funny Exactly. Totally trying to cover for yourself right now. Is that why you sound so normal right now? That's the joke,

that is I think that is the joke. I think you're absolutely right. And unfortunately, I do look kind of bizarre and crazy because I'm old. I have no hair, but I gotta make up for it. Huh? So Muppets, I mean, actually, this is great. What a Segway, guys. Muppets. I mean, I grew up in the Muppets, and I I grew up in the eighties is well,

and I think, like, you know, man looking at your work, it's just And I was saying this earlier like I was scrolling through just before we got on, Just immerse myself again in your stuff, and it's like, Man, I just this I love it on a whole bunch of different levels and I imagine, like, fans of your stuff, like for some, For some people like me, it's like nostalgia, plus new technology stuff. But then for for other people that weren't born in the didn't grow up in the eighties,

you know, it's It's still cool cause the eighties is like, cool and I feel like it always will be. But I just wonder where you know, you grew up in it. I assume so. Like, is that where the eighties sort of, uh, your style comes from? Yeah, Yeah. We'll

pick up from 100%. Yeah. Yeah, like I was born in 1977. So, you know, when I hit five or whatever, that was 1982 and it was right at ready for the start of, you know, Transformers G I, Joe, he man and all that stuff in the eighties, I've been saying it for years. Like theeighties was just the greatest time to be a kid because everything was there was intellectual property that was just being thrown at you all the time like unique intellectual vanity. So all of these these studios were making new things and throw them at kids every Saturday morning. And that made up, you know,

the language and the visual language of growing up in the eighties. And it was all very, you know, enthusiastic and bright and just really fun, you know. And the eighties eighties is the perfect decade for being awesome and ridiculous at the exact same time as I love that, you know? So, yeah, that that my childhood definitely informs the stuff that I do now. Um,

yeah, I bet. And actually, you nailed it with the ridiculous and awesome e. I was talking with somebody recently about, like, the music of the eighties and and how it just had that verse. It was like in terms of what was popular, you know, you got boy George. But then you've got, you know, guns and roses. They're like like, there's just like this, But everyone liked, you know,

or at least I remember me and my friends We would like we would like Michael Jackson. But we're also like Duran Duran. You there was just like, this variety, right?

Yeah, it was really weird. And, you know, even even at the time, the undercurrent would have been You know, punk was still pretty prevalent in the early eighties. And, you know, you have that running right alongside people like, you know, Michael Jackson and Miami Sound Machine. And, you know, whatever Bobby McFarren like. I don't know what My gosh. Right?

Yeah, like it was such a great time again to be to be young, to be a kid and, you know, kind of discovering all the things on your own and being informed by, like, you know, this is this is something I think about often like how the equivalent of the Internet when we were kids was the playground. Because that's when, yeah, that's when we sort of got Really Yeah, we've kind of got, um, exposed to different movies and TV shows and whatever just based on what the other kids were talking about. Music is no different. Like I would have probably learned about Michael Jackson because a friend of mine was part of this fan club or something,

you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah, which is It's great.

Yeah, that's so true. The playground. That's how you found about

stuff. Yeah. And, you know, I guess we could just log on to Facebook now or see what people are tweeting about it. That's how we find out about stuff. But yeah, when you're when you're a kid, it's just other kids.

Yeah, and I feel like it's it's a drink is back. Then I feel like there was a shared experience around things that that that may be. It is only online today, Um, where, you know, you could ever remember going into kindergarten and being like, Yeah. Did you got I didn't even have to ask. Like, you just start talking about the Captain America special. That was and and like, because that was the only thing on you know, you could. That's the only thing you could watch. Everybody was watching it.

And now it's sort of you don't splintered off. I mean, it's positive in other ways, but But that, like finding finding your playground right is the new is the important thing for people, I guess. On the internet,

man, I think you just named this podcast. Finding your playground five. Your playground. Oh,

man, you know what? I think you're right. And often the title is the hardest part. Hey there, Ugo. Like that? With that other way, I feel a sense of relief.

That's incredible. Way we could wrap this up now. Thanks, James. Take care. Talking. Talking. Uh, yeah, I don't even

know. Like I said, I was scrolling through your stuff. There's so much amazing art. It's just immersive. I feel like even your your avatar's are like, I I just I just like I'm so happy to talk to you because I feel like, uh, just this just makes me happy to see your stuff.

Thanks, man. I really appreciate that review because, you know, when it took me a while to find out what my creative voice was and like the goal, the ultimate goal, the night that I ended up stumbling upon was like, I need to in the final peace when it's done, I need to display that. I had fun making it right. So it was made with enthusiasm and just ah, love of whatever content I was exploring. And so I appreciate that. I appreciate that it may do that. Then it had a an effect on your on how you were feeling because that's exactly what what the ultimate goal is right. I want to create art that looks like it was fun to make.

Oh, man. Well, that's you nailed it every time. Honestly, and you know, in some of that for me, obviously, like there's so many things that ah, I'm I love about, you know, Tron or video games or the buy video games. I mean, original course. Yeah, Yeah, in,

like, um, in since we've stuff and actually, I have to confess, like I, um, in doing my little research here for today. Um, I know, outrun as a game as a game. Eighties was one of my favorites, too.

I loved it. It was

something about it, right? I think we have a steering wheel, and that that just helps automatically, but yeah, it's like the like, the convertible. You know, you're driving a convertible. Whatever. But anyway, I realize that that's also like a term for genre of stuff that I feel like you probably are. Well, deep into Is that

right? Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, uh, it is a weird like and this is kind of like, uh, of, ah, large story, so I'll try to condense it down as much as I can. But when I started doing this kind of 19 eighties flavor artwork, this would have been like the late to thousands. We're talking 2008 or something, and I didn't even know what synth wave was at the time. And I think it only existed on you. Don't my space or something like that and write Write little did I know that my artwork was kind of headed on a collision course with the music genre.

So, like when people were making these this music inspired by old video games and John Carpenter movies, everything all this 19 eighties content, they didn't really have a cohesive visual style going through. Like into the 2010 11 12. And I ended up stumbling upon the music genre and thought like, Man like these, these musicians are making artwork that sounds like the soundtrack of what I'm trying to create with my artwork. It was a riff, Yeah, nothing. We're synergy. And, you know, I reached out to some of these artists and ended up striking up a dialog with some of them and made a conscious effort in 2014 2 You know, I'm the kind of herbs,

you know, I don't I would never say like, I'm inspired by music or I get my ideas from dreams or that kind of stuff, like I never, never, ever said that because it's never happened to me except for synth way. That was the very first time. And you know, when I when I would listen to this. This style of music images would pop into my head of your palm trees and Lamborghinis and some ray ban sunglasses. And so I mean, I made a conscious effort in 14 2002. You know, let's let's let the music Dr. Uh, What I want to create visually and let's see what happens And,

uh wow. And that's how my work kind of God it was just right place, right time and lightning in a bottle kind of thing. But when I released my overdrive, Siri's back in 2014 that kind of caught fire within the synth wave genre. And, you know, and that's what kind of established my studio within since wave. And, you know, I could not be happier because it's far by, by far my favorite musical genre out there and and it's filled with such amazing people, and it's wonderful. Yeah, it was a great thing to have happen.

What a story that that I love that that the music was part of that and that those worlds collided

at the same time. Yeah, it was. It's the very first time, you know, and it's something that couldn't be. It couldn't be planned. You know it. The rise of stone cold Steve Austin could not be planned. And the same the same thing with my art and simply, you know, I didn't I didn't orchestrate that at all. It just it just happened that we were just happened. Everybody was on a collision course, and it just kind of, gentlemen about 2014. 2015.

Really cool. It's awesome. Oh, my goodness. Now a little bit more about today's sponsor for a decade, metal lab has helped some of the world's top companies and entrepreneurs build products that millions of people use every day. He probably didn't realize it at the time, but odds are you used in app that they've helped design or build absolutely slack coin base, Oculus, Facebook Messenger, Lonely Planet and many more metal. Abbe wants to bring their unique design philosophy to your project. Let them take your brainstorm and turn it into the next $1,000,000,000 app from ideas sketched on the back of a napkin to a final shipped product. Check them out at meta lab dot Co. That's metal ab dot Co, and when you do get in touch. Tell them Damn the puppets are you?

How did you get started then? And it was art. Always something you did, you know, even back in the eighties when

you're growing up. Oh, yeah, for sure. I started drawing when I was, like, four years old, so this would have been in 1981 And, you know, I would always Mom got Mom always bought some good typewriter paper, and she would always tell me like, Don't write it. Don't draw on this stuff. Drawn the line stuff, the cheaper stuff. She wanted the blank, but the typewriter paper.

Yeah, it was It was blank. So it was way better to drawn, so she couldn't keep it in the house. I'd always find where she hated and drawn it all stuff. So, uh, all the way through the eighties, yeah. I was drawing my favorite cartoon characters like you grow up drawing simple stuff, like, you know, Garfield. And, you know, when this instance got being a strong yes,

and then you kind of graduate from cartoon characters into comic books. And then you start drawing comic book characters and wrestlers and stuff me and my made my buddy Mike Mike feels from back home in Nova Scotia like Here's my my childhood best friend and we were We were into the all of that stuff when it rose like old in it like a Nintendo. The Nintendo Entertainment System, The Super yes, yeah, like horror movies, comic books, wrestling like we were into all that stuff and it always paired with drawing and creativity. So if we were in the wrestlers, we'd be making up our own wrestlers. If we were into comic books, we were making up her own comic book characters. And so it's creativity is something that I've that's been with me my entire life. Like I've never I've never been without a drawing on the go or a sketchbook or or something. Yeah, it's something I've never stopped

in creating some of your pieces. Now, Um, do they start on paper? And then and then how much is is analog versus digital again?

Yeah, pretty much. Everything that I do starts with the sketch book. So that's that's just the natural way for me to kind of get my ideas down quickly, and I could do it away from the desk as Well, I can grab it, Grandma, sketch, book and pencil and go to a cafe or the local pub or whatever and just kind of get my ideas down. So if sometimes it's, uh know when to split off and go, like, go directly into the digital So I'll sketch something out and then go, Okay, I'm gonna recreate this an illustrator or draw it in from a shop in this antique or something. But sometimes the line does get blurred where I'll draw something in the sketchbook like some thumbnails or whatever. And then I'll doom or realized drawings.

Well, get the lines tighter or whatever and that scan that in and then build the vectors on top of that. So I know exactly where everything is. It's I do treat like for digital art, and you treat this sketch book as the blueprint. Like the roadmap, I figure out all the problems ahead of time. So when I get on three, get into illustrator Photoshopped. That kind of reduces the amount of time I spend noodling around on problem solving because I figured out, yeah, where the highlights are gonna be, where the shadows are. That kind of stuff

that makes sense. All like, the composition and stuff is on paper. And then, Ah, a lot of like looking at a three year through your portfolio and and seeing, like, really cool lettering like I'm seeing things like stay rad and actually single noise itself. Um and then I and I realized, Oh, you you released the front based on the it's super amazing which I after we hang up, I'm going to buy it because I think that takes a lot of work out of trying to take a brush out and doing

that. Goddamn Dan, You ever made a phone?

You know what's funny? Is I? Actually, I actually do have ah, long time ago. Ah, it's a It was a pixel fought called Camelia and sort of like a little ah, pixel art icons were special characters, and yeah, but but but But anyway, like that one little foray into it, like using I can't remember what? What? Whatever. At the time, this is probably 10 15 years ago, whatever that the fought making software at the time was, it was it was horrible. I mean, it was really difficult to learn,

and I didn't know what the hell I was

doing? Oh, man, it was a miracle. So I yeah, How was it creating? Ah NIU NIU are right. That's with

the funnest. It was horrible God, like it was It was like, Okay, here's how it went like And I'm sure it was the same with you. Like you make all the letters and that's the fun part, right? So you can make it in vector or whatever you're doing and you build all the letter forms like Alright, these things look really cool. And then, like all right, I'm done. Yeah, just of GPS done. But then it's like, Oh, OK, now I got to compile these damn things in and like photographers what I used

and yeah, I think that's what I think. That's exactly what I used

to. You and I might have been using the same program from the same error that you did, because I think it's a I don't know if they just never updated it or it's just always been terrible, but it's just like what? What the hell. So after you plug in all the letters, then you have to What's it called? Uh, pair the pears turning your pages

or something? Yeah, exactly. All the space in between. Yeah, that was a nightmare. And even like in the vertical spacing Thio figure

that out. Yeah, like it's horrible, man. Like it's you know, and I think like maybe having something that had more static letter forms might have been easier. But for me, I had all these stupid brush strokes so some of them would have won splatter. That's way off to the side that I don't see. So it bumps the other letter, like, four miles down the track. Why is there so?

Oh, gosh, yeah, right. Worst. It's just looking at the fun, though. That must have been really challenged. The like, the sort of the swash of the breaststroke being different depending

on the letter yet, Dan, I've never been the same since it is broke me?

Well, this is a bummer to here, and that is that we thought that we'll see from

you are a man by See that one done that for it sold really well and you know it did. It did. It was again a really big surprise, but it did really well. So now I'm like? Well, I should, you know, I should do and do another one. But, you know, I've got because of me own war. Like I got weird tics now and I'm scared of celery and weird stuff, so I don't know. It's like my brain doesn't work the same as it used to be. Oh, we'll see.

Someone needs someone listening. The dozens there listening. Someone needs t o. That was being generous, I think, actually doesn't. But so when he's, you know, I fear ah font software expert. What's you know, you gotta put up with James

on. Yeah,

because I mean jeez, but I mean the rest. So the ah, it's like the rad movie poster. Right? Uh, you create you That vibe is like what you can do with your fun. It's so

cool. Basically, that's it. Yeah, like if you look at the rad logo and if you look at the logo for they live a John Carpenter movie like, yeah, you know, if you take my font and squish it a little bit, I could just hear all the typographer Z If they're like, you know, you never squish Alfond, But if you do that I don't Yeah, my crackers unfold the rules, so if you squish mind, it's almost like it's very comparable. Thio funded. They live which,

you know, I just I just love it. Thanks, man. Yeah, it was basically built because, you know, I didn't I kind of sensed an opportunity. Sure, like business wise. But honestly, I just wanted the fund for myself because at the time I've been doing so many brush type kind of word marks and stuff. I thought, like, you know, I kind of wish there was a font that looked like the logo over. They lived, so I just made it, and, uh,

I feel like it's I feel like it's a given a gift, Honestly, like that. That kind of stuff is because it's just hard to do. It's hard to recreate. It's funny, right? Sometimes it's hard to re create things that are old Derek from before the digital era or whatever.

It's weird, isn't it? It's like we can't We can't figure out how the pyramids were built, even with today's technology, right, and it's the same with eighties there. But that's all that's a very big stretch of making right now. is comparing eighties hair rush to the pyramids. But I love it, you know? But it is like you look at those covers for, like, I don't know anything by Judas Priest in the eighties, for example, and write, write that stuff. It has a grit.

It has a real nous to it. And that's because it's physical pain hitting a physical canvas. And, you know, we just as good as we get digitally. We can't recreate that, you know, it's perfect,

I amen. Yeah, you're right. And I think I read this somewhere where you you had a goal of getting into the movie poster world? Yeah. And then and then you actually have a couple that are amazing. Like drunk drive is one of them, which is a great movie that just seeing that that movie paired with you and your art is like, Oh, that's just a no brainer. That's, you know, like, um, but how is that, like getting like, creating a poster for a movie and, uh, sort

of you could share a little bit? Yeah, sure it was. It was ultimately something that was, like a failed experiment on my part. You know, if This was right around the time when Mondo was really hitting it big with their with their movie licenses and a lot of other coming out culture art galleries were coming out of the woodwork. And, you know, I thought like, Oh, man, like that's That's totally what I want to do And I've kind of flirted with movie posters over the years like you said with the With the drive poster and with I did a couple for Trond way back in the day and a couple of weird abstract 2001 Space Odyssey stuff. But

that was like one of we gotta come

back to drawn by the way, those of my favorite words Man, I'll always go back to trauma. But so yeah, right around this time And this would have been man 11 4012 when I just wantto really wanted to get into the movie poster biz. But what I Unfortunately it's kind of a bummer of a story, because it it felt like a gated community to me where only in its companies, right, it's just cos that that pain get the licenses and they have their set of people that they work with, and that's pretty much it. So is much is a CZ, much as I wanted to do. Ah, hey, man, poster or poster for the thing Or, you know,

no country for old men are Indiana Jones or whatever. We just couldn't get the proper permission to do these things. Why would create these posters spend, you know, days or weeks making these things. And then I couldn't sell them because I was scared. Thio get sued or cease and desist or any of that kind of stuff. So and I see why. And it's a difficult it's Ah, it's heard racket, man. And if people manage to get like, you know, the mon does and whoever like these people can get the they have the money and the contacts to get the keys to the kingdom. But if you're, you know,

a punk living up in Nova Scotia, Canada, like like I had, I had no chance of being involved in that stuff. Sometimes it worked out. The drive poster was an official released that my agent Alex ended up working out license, and yes, we have we just underground. It was right place at the right at the right time like we just happened to be the first in the door. Thio get the drive license and that we became an official unofficial products, which is really cool. But you know, has really happened too often.

Yeah, I mean, that's that's really interesting here. Like it's like this Ah exclusive club industry that's been around forever, that it's

hard to get into. Yeah, yeah, it's, uh, it's cool like and I have friends that work that work on movie posters all the time, which is amazing. It's and it's a lot more. I guess maybe I was just get trying to get into it Thio to earlier whatever. But there's a lot more opportunity now because there's a lot more people that get licenses to these things. So it's like a strange old yeah, like our galleries, that kind of stuff. And so it's a lot easier Thio to get in contact with people that have these licenses, which is amazing. My friends, that bottleneck gallery,

one of those those companies, they've been amazing vice press over here in the UK like they're amazing and yeah, yeah, like some great people doing some great work. Um, I'm just kind of because of my experience five years ago or whatever it was, I'm

kind of past it now Sort of way. I have a couple questions. I want to fire off that I ask everybody here and you're the 3rd 3rd for everybody being three at this point. What's a recent adventure that you've You've got off?

Well, uh, but the biggest thing that I've ever done essentially in my life. And I would quantify this as a big adventure Waas moving over over here to the u K. So I live in Newcastle upon time now in the north of England, and I'm left over here because I married a British girl. Essentially. Yeah, yeah. Naomi Naomi Hawkinson. I'm the only white and, uh, wait, Got married being directed by Thanks, man. Thank you. So,

yeah, we got married and then started the process of getting visas and shipping all my stuff over. And that was by further the biggest adventure that I've ever been on because its ups and downs and a lot of a lot of emotions kind of switching gears a lot, you know, it's really yesterday. Yeah, man. Sad to leave my, You know, I lived in Nova Scotia, Canada, like most of my life, So leaving my family and my friends, everything that you're sad. But starting a new life over here with my wife is super like amazing. So it's like very ups and downs and stuff.

So that was definitely the biggest adventure because, you know, it kind of throws you into a a realm that's really unfamiliar. You know what it's a lot of You have to convince a foreign government that it's okay to live with my wife. You know, it's really weird.

It's grow just really busy. Yeah, I was like, Why I have

to do that? We Oh, that's the way things were built. I guess you gotta do that kind of stuff, but yeah,

D no, that's a huge. That's a huge adventure s. Oh, yeah. He grew up in Nova Scotia, right? And yeah, and and then and now you're in AA UK. How will that affect your work?

It's, you know, it's what us that man because, like, a lot of projects of mine are on hold until I got here because you know the logistics, you know? Well, that's all the stuff that needs to happen before I can actually live a normal life, but would have noticed immediately. Like Lupin. Like I just released issue. One of my zine called off the grid, and this is a great This is actually a great a great example of how things change when I moved over here because, um, England is, I don't know if you've noticed England's a hell of a lot smaller than Canada s. Oh,

uh, yeah, yeah, it's, um, you know and everything. Everything here moves quicker, so it's easier to send something from the south of England to the north of England, whereas in Canada we can't have print on demand surfaces because the country is just too damn big for it. And shipping would grow the ruin, that kind of thing. So my Xena, I basically could not have done in Canada the way that I wanted to do it, and here I can order all the bits, the cards, the stickers,

the bags, mailers and busines himself, and I kind of everything delivered in about a week. And wow, that that's that's crazy. That's a crazy time line. And that makes publishing quarterly really accessible, you know? So that's

just something that is that Is that the goal for you with the scene? Like a like a more regular

release? Yeah. Yeah. My 2nd 1 is due out. Let me check. I think it's November 28th. Let me check my count. Great hero, man. It is soon. And Dan, you got the scoop November 28. I didn't even announce that yet. So, uh wow, folks,

you heard it here. That's right. Right here in the simple. But, uh, that's that's amazing. Uh, and you know, the first issue, the first of all, looks amazing. And, uh, you know, trading card and awesome sticker t like That's just but ah, it's sold out quick. Did so the response

with his man. Yeah, we're heading for a second printing of issue one, and that is something I Okay, I did not see that coming at all, you know, because it's it's some, you know, this is T to dilute a little bit. My zine is sort of a like I've always wanted to do an art book because I have colleagues in the industry that air doing art books, you know, Aaron, draft Lynn has an art book. And John Cotino. Yeah, a lot of other. Yeah,

those were great. Fantastic. And I've always wanted to an art book, but I don't want to spend two years writing the damn thing. So and this is this is another way of me tapping into my childhood and buying wizard magazines comic book magazine in the early buying image, comics and the kind of thing where it was something that came out every month or every few months. And this is my way of doing an art book by not doing an art book. I'm releasing it in issues. Um, well, I love that. That's fun. Man is going to quarterly for a year. And, yes, I'm already deep into into put together issue to So it's super fun.

So cool. I can't wait. I love that as an alternative to writing a giant book, actually, super

inspiring. You don't. All right again, stuff you have, You ever Have you ever done it in the book? Yeah.

So I've got I've got several. Ah, several Web design books back in the day. It's been a while since I released something, but, um, these air those arm or Ah, they're about CSS and Web standards, every creating, creating websites, basically. So it's been a long It's been a long time. And now I'm so out of touch with I'm so behind on that stuff. I'm not authorized Thio give any sort of direction in in ah, CSS or whatever, but But I just love like the tattoo, you know,

like that E You know, creating tactile things is something I'm getting back into and beautiful like nothing beats that. You know, when you when you're working on a screen, all for years,

right? Yeah, Daniel, Totally right. You hit the nail square in the end like tactile things And let's not snooping around your adventures website before we went live beautiful work before and, you know Oh, yeah, that's that's the kind of stuff like it's tangible, right? So it's clear that into into being out like outdoorsy stuff and making stuff, too, you know you can wear and that you can wear with pride while doing these activities. And that's yeah, yeah, and that gets it off of the damn screen. You know, like,

uh, everything is vessels these days or buried in social media posts or whatever. If you can give something to somebody or the order it or whatever that they can wear on their head or wear on their chest or they can read while in a cafe or laying on the coach or something, I mean, that's real experience. Like Scroll. It's sweeping through. Instagram isn't Isn't rial to me anyway. Yeah, so Yeah, you're right.

You nailed it, too. I mean, ah, all these things, That technology is wonderful, and it's allowing us to connect in different ways. And it's so cool. But, you know, I think we still need that. Those things we can hold, you know, and feel in. I'm just I'm so I'm happy to see doing that as well. I can't wait t get my hands on. So

you want about that? Get what else? Anyone I

was waiting for The reprint that I missed out on it sold out so fast. You know, it's a good problem. So cool. Um so also are So another question would be What? What are you listening to these days? Oh, man. And this is Yeah, I'm really I know you mentioned Cem Cem synth wave stuff before, but you know, who knows? Maybe you're listening to, you know, handled.

That is, but, uh yeah, no, it's Yeah, it's synth wave almost all day, man. It's just reforms my work so well. And, you know, I'll get I'll get some showed up. Samantha, Son, some of the groups that Yeah,

I'm curious because I I like this genre too. Yeah, and I but I don't know, a ton of I don't know what son of artists like calm truces. My feet.

Yeah, but truth is kind of one of the front runners to that back in the

day. I feel like that, but yeah, I feel like they've

been around for a long time. Yeah, just a showed it. A couple like I'm really into gunship there, Over here in the down in London, in the UK I love gunships music Arcade High is awesome. My homies that I just did an album cover for their awesome Oh, cool guys. Wolf Club is another one. Some great music coming up by Wolf Club. The carpenter brute is kind of the first since wave act that I got into back in the day and and his work just keeps getting better and better. He's so good, Nina, over here in the UK again. Like she releases some. Oh, yeah.

Beautiful albums. Like really good. Really worth worth checking out. Parallels there Canadian there from Toronto. I do believe in parallels. Are are amazing. Dance of the dead. If, uh if you like some, like, let's retire your stuff. Um And, uh, yeah, there's I could go on and on. But,

you know, this is a seriously good future. Cops another one. Power glove, like, Yeah, we're all the bride, my man FM 84. Yeah, they're all worth checking out. And yeah, I can. I'll send you a list. And if you want, If you want to check out something

called Abby, still be amazing. Yeah, because I can share in the show. Notes still living. Get people get people on these on these folks. I mean, the names are the same. It's just like, great gunship

is like everything. What? Anything with a wolf is incredible. Thes people are really kind of like you can tell they're going right back to the Joan Carpenter in the eighties and yes, such a great a great

scene, man. Ah, just makes me. Oh, God. All right, to switch gears a little bit, although, you know, seeing your work, I know you're in this space and and you're you know, you've done a lot of cool, like stickers and patches that air in the speech. Sean Drea. Like NASA Exploration? Well, yeah. I mean, this is kind of a dumb question, but is there life on other planets

that's not done at all? This'd enemy I'm I'm a big believer in, uh, the mathematics of everything. So, you know, when you look at their there's a 1,000,000,000 stars in her galaxy alone, and then there's like, a 1,000,000,000 Galaxies up there. It's like it just comes down to simple math. If we got if we have a few planets around, most of those stars were made even half of those stairs. I mean, like a planet. It's on Lee. It's like the planet has to be not too big, not too small and just the right distance away from the star to have conditions that can make a planet.

So, you know. Yeah, I 100%. Uh, you know, I would say I believe that there is life out there. I mean, it's just it would seem rather impossible that it would wouldn't be up there. Um, and they're and they're going to stay the hell away from us. I can tell you that.

Maybe it probably be smart. Thio. Maybe they're just waiting,

waiting to see how it plays out. If we're going to hear that they were going to shoot at us, So let's stay away from there.

I always think of like, you know, science sci fi movies, and I'm a big, big fan of anything sci fi. But like you start to think about like these movies, they seem crazy at the time, and some of them are. But But it's like if what is possible for someone to visit here or, you know, I just love thinking about that like the like trying to think about the reality of what would have happened, How would we How would we even react to knowing or whatever? There's just the science of it is,

Is it? Yeah, the science of it end like the social aspect, like, honestly, Dan, if if If if aliens showed up at 7 a.m. One morning, would you go to work exactly right, right, right. Yeah. Way.

Yeah. You're prob probably

know like that. Some now that I'm going to send that client can wait.

Yeah, see, that's you. Did you just You just nailed it. That's why I love this thinking about stuff. Because I think it does put, regardless of what the reality is. And I agree with you. I think this mathematically, it just has to happen. But like, it does put in perspective. Um, and I think whatever I think about space, anything space, you know, it puts puts me into perspective.

Like, if I'm worried about something, you know, it seems a little bit small, You know, when I think about the

bigger one percent, it is all perspective, you know, and like and we're not going to get into current events and stuff. But when you turn on the news and then you start thinking about like just because, like a meteor slammed into the earth back when the dinosaurs were here, it doesn't mean it won't happen again. It's so it's like exactly what is what are we arguing about when that could happen? You know, that's that's kind of bleak. So right when this team to stand down turn. But yeah.

No, I I think you're right. Though I totally I've had that thought many times. Exactly. Ah, it And I think that's actually helpful even though it's a little c f or a little darker, scary. But like, I think it's actually helpful to have that

just to keep Absolutely. Yeah, I agree, man. I just I wish more people would expose.

So my last question is, um is just like if you had something to share with folks that air coming up and and maybe trying to do what you're doing and and get get to where James Wade race. You know what? What? Something that's that's helpful, Um, that you found over over the course of your career,

right? Yeah. Um, I think I'll loop this into, like, a, uh, advice that I wish I got when I was, you know, a teenager or or in my early career, something that well freed up like this. Uh, I wish somebody told me, Like like I said earlier in the podcast, you know, I grew up drawing and I never stopped drawing, so it was always a creative kid and always tryingto you know,

draw something or figure something out to create something. And the advice I wish I got waas you're doing You're doing the right thing. You're doing exactly what you need to be doing at the time that you needed to do it. And that comes into just base level perseverance. Just keep keep banging the drone, keep exploring, stay curious and and never stop, you know, and frustration is a part of all of everything that we do is supposed to be there like we're not as creative people. We're not supposed to be content with what we're doing. We're supposed to be free, and we're support supposed to be looking for the next thing. We're supposed to be sharpening your sword and getting down, getting down to business. And, you know,

we got to create a lot of terrible things before we can create the good things and, you know, so that that's the thing that I learned. Um, fairly like I would say recently in terms of my career may be over the last 10 years that what I was doing back then was exactly what I needed to be doing. And it's and most creative people are. There's very, very, very few people in this industry that I've met is that just decided to be creative when they were, like, 25 or something like remain. We roll out of kids growing up to some degree or we had an interest in it. So, you know, it's just that, you know,

frustration is a good thing. Thio have were being artist for being creative. So yeah, that that was the biggest thing that I that I learned and it took it. It only took the benefit of time to really realize

it. No. Yeah, that's that's that's wisdom. Okay. Yeah, I love that man. I think, uh, so often, e I remember for me to like I just remember asking myself, Yeah, I my dear, am I doing the right thing? Have sort of a goal in mind or where I want to get to you. But what is what I'm doing, right?

Right. The right thing. And I think that's I think that's really good advice. You that just get being creative. And I were

you. I assume you were a creative kid growing up too, right? Did you draw a painter or any of that stuff. Yeah,

yeah, yeah, Totally. Meet music Crusher Big time and, ah, creating music. But yet drawing to you like I mean, I was never like I never got to the point where I I knew that that was my strongest suit. I just loved creating things. And, um, you know, it it definitely you were talking earlier about growing up, destroying, like whatever it was you were into at the time, you know, drawing around it.

That's definitely that was saying, um you know, w w Nintendo. Ah, you know, every everything. Um, and I think that at least back then it was It was like I wanted more of all of that because we didn't have. We had such a limited window of that at the time. You know, I could only go to the arcade something ah, week, ever. And and so that, like, loving something and trying to,

um, create more of it, like if I can't consume it more because of whatever. Then then I try to create it on my own, right? And maybe that's where that comes from.

Yeah, totally. This loops right back to what we were talking about earlier that tactile thing, like even when we were kids. You want to like, I want to create my own wrestling, trading curds and that kind of stuff. That's maybe, you know adults. Yeah, maybe that's just what we're we're still doing. We're just trying to still create Those were trying to create something physical or digital, but something that's like, I'm into this and I think other people will be too. So

I'm gonna make it. Thanks for listening to the simple bit show. I'm Dan Cedar Home. Very special thanks to James White for that awesome conversation. Thank you, too metal out for sponsoring. And if you dig it, rate in her review us on Apple podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts would really appreciate that. Send me any feedback to Dan at simple bits dot com, and we'll see you on the next show.